Season 4: Episode 3: Samar Jha

Government Affairs Director at AARP

Samar Jha

Government Affairs Director at AARP

How to get a job in public policy as an LLM?

When Samar graduated with his LLM, like most of his classmates, he was looking at opportunities in BigLaw. His then-girlfriend (now wife) encouraged him to look into a public policy fellowship at the City Council of Philadelphia. He never looked back. He ended up being the first foreign-trained lawyer ever offered the fellowship, which was followed by another advocacy position at a trade organization before he became the Government Affairs Director at AARP, the influential organization that represents the interest of Americans age fifty and over.

How did he find his first permanent job in the U.S.?

What got him hired as the first ever foreign-trained lawyer and fellow at the City Council of Philadelphia?

What advice does he have for those who are interested in public policy and public interest work?  

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Where did you grow up?

I grew up in India, in a city called Jamshedpur, which close to Kolkata. If you have heard of the big conglomerate Tata Group, their first steel plant was based in my hometown. After law school, I worked in New Delhi in corporate law firms for around six years and a half years.

And what did you do in the corporate law firm?

I did basic corporate work, like mergers and acquisition, aircraft leasing and financing, banking and finance.

Why did you choose to study law?

I'm the first lawyer in my family. Most of my cousins and everyone else is either a doctor or an engineer. So my parents were not too happy about me going to law school initially. But I was one of the rebels. I think I made the right decision, and I loved it. And I wanted to do something other than engineering or med school.

Why did you study law in the United States?

I worked in corporate law firms in India, I think I was burned out. The number of hours you work can be laborious. So I was looking to take a break, I was looking to pursue higher studies in the U.S.

What languages do you speak? And what do you do as a multilingual lawyer?

I speak English and Hindi. I understand Urdu, as Urdu is similar to Hindi. I understand Bengali because of the region I'm from has lots of Bengali influence. I also understand a little Punjabi. In India, all the legal work and court documents are in English, especially in the higher courts such as the High Courts and Supreme Court, everything is in English.

You are the Government Affairs Director at AARP, or the American Association of Retired Persons, a powerful interest group representing the interest of people over fifty. Could you tell us more about your current work at AARP?

I lead the local and state housing advocacy for our 53 state offices. And when I say 53 state offices, my geography is not wrong. It's basically 50 states and three territories in DC, Puerto Rico and Virgin Islands.

Since at AARP we have all these state offices, when there's a housing issue at the local and state level legislation, I work with our state offices to come up with legislative strategy, reviewing legislation, and preparing testimony. I have given testimony at the state senate or a state house of representatives, even at a local city council.

That’s the kind of work I love, because I get to work on housing issues from New York to Wyoming, from Hawaii to California. I can see the trends, or what's happening on housing policy across the country.

Could you give us an example of the specific kind of issue you currently work on?

Absolutely. The US is going through a housing crisis. Housing prices are going up everywhere. Lots of people who are experiencing homelessness. The eviction rates are going up. Many people spend more than 30% of their income on housing. A lot of the issues we focus on right now is about housing supply. There's not enough housing being built. And people do not have options.

At AARP, we advocate for people who are over fifty years old, or older adults. So we advocate for creating more housing options for these people. If someone wants to live in a big single-family house, they should be able to. If someone wants to live in something else, they should have different options of housing.

We go at the local and state level and advocate to improve laws to allow for more housing options. Local and state governments have a lot of control over laws relating to housing, i.e. what kind of housing is built in your neighborhood, or in your city.

We also work a lot on landlord-tenant issues. There are cases where certain tenants don't have rights to ensure they aren't evicted unfairly. We work on making sure both landlords and tenants have an equal footing in court. From the landlord's perspective, we make sure tenants don't take advantage of them.

Another big area we focus on is state budgets. Every year, during the budget season at the local or state level, we get involved. Big cities in the U.S. have strong city council systems and significant budgets. For example, Philadelphia has a yearly budget of close to $10 billion, and New York's is close to $100 billion. A big city operates like a large corporation, with a massive budget to ensure all services are funded. Local governments are the ones who fix your potholes and make tangible changes. We partner with local governments to bring about real change.

Is public policy work something you have always wanted to pursue? How did you end up working for AARP?

When I graduated from law school in India in 2008, and then did my LLM at Penn in 2015, everyone wanted to go to big law. Yes, I also wanted to do that too. I probably would have ended up at a law firm in India, the UK, Singapore, or Hong Kong. But it's funny how things happened. At that time, my now wife—we were dating then—suggested a different path. She mentioned a graduate public policy fellowship at the City Council of Philadelphia and encouraged me to apply. At that time, I was probably the first foreign-trained lawyer to get the fellowship.

It was basically an internship with not much money, I can tell you that. But the work was so rewarding, I loved it. I worked for the City Council President in Philly, essentially part of an in-house research team for all 17 council members. Councilmembers and their staff could come to us for public policy research on issues like criminal justice, housing, transportation, and various public services.

I loved the work I did at the fellowship and fell in love with public policy work. And having the legal training helped my work and I could review legislation much easier.

The takeaway here is that always listen to your wife!

Haha. Yeah. That’s the first takeaway. And the second takeaway is that it's never too late to pivot your career. Lots of people reach their mid 30s and told themselves: it's done. Now I have to stick with what I'm doing. It's not true.

How did you get your first permanent job after your policy and fellowship?

During my fellowship, I had done a lot of work for different council members within the City Council. As my fellowship was wrapping up, I knew I needed to find a full-time position. One of the council members' staff suggested there was an opening at the Greater Philadelphia Association of Realtors, a trade association for real estate agents. He said, he’d be happy to recommend me. He has seen my work and liked it.

So that’s what he did. Luckily, the interview went well. I got the position. To be honest, when I was going through the fellowship and applying for other policy positions, I thought I'd start as an analyst or in a junior role, not a director position. But they saw my previous experience and offered me the role of Director of Government and Public Affairs. I was lucky to get that. I became the lobbyist for the trade association, doing City Council lobbying in Philly and some state advocacy work as well.

You mentioned earlier that you are the first foreign-trained lawyer being offered the fellowship? What are the qualifications that make you stand out?

I think Philly is very open in terms of hiring people from diverse backgrounds. Having the legal training and experience back home also makes a huge difference. They hadn't had an LLM student apply for the fellowship before. A lot of LLM students and those looking for big law positions miss out on opportunities because they don't diversify their search. I diversified my job search and was willing to do a fellowship.

I always tell new lawyers that lawyering skills are invaluable in public policy work. Advocacy work involves legislative strategy, drafting legislation, and negotiating legislation, much like being a corporate lawyer negotiating a transaction. When I draft legislation, it's not the finished product. It gets negotiated with various stakeholders, including lawmakers, staff, and industry advocates. For example, with housing legislation, housing advocates and real estate industry advocates all have their own interests and negotiate with each other.

The interview for the job went well. I remember I talked to my mother specifically after being offered the interview. She said do not say anything against nonlawyers. So I didn't. I just said I find it easy and fun to review legislation. My lawyering skills acquired as a transactional lawyer can be very much transferable when doing advocacy and policy work.

Another takeaway from this is always listen to your mother!

Yeah. Absolutely. Another takeaway is your lawyering skills are transferable.

What American legal TV shows or movies informed or inspire you about American legal profession?

Let me start by saying everyone probably mentions Suits. I've heard your other interviews but this show highlights what not to do as a lawyer. If you're taking the MPRE, you could watch one episode and think about the ethical violations it portrays because every episode features one.

It's almost unbelievable how they manage it, but Suits is a show that inspires you to avoid ethical mistakes, as the entire premise is based on violations. I used to love Boston Legal, an older show that shows my age. There's also an Aussie show on Netflix called Fisk. It's really funny. It's about a lawyer working in a wills and estate law firm in suburban Melbourne.

Is there any advice you would give your younger self?

Just diversify your job search. I should have done that a lot earlier. I understand that everyone from law school wants to go to big law, and I get that. But if I were younger, I would tell myself that there are many different opportunities out there, especially in public policy and public interest. Look for those opportunities, and you'll sleep better at night.